The Epic Hikago Rewatch: Episodes 7 and 8

[hostilecrayon]

This week’s character spotlight is Fujisaki Akari!



Akari’s official title is “the Neighbor”. What do you think of this title? Even though she is present for much of the series and is a friend of Hikaru’s (and quite possibly romantically interested in him as well), she still only gets the designation of neighbor. Does this have a deeper meaning?

How do you feel about Akari? What kind of person is she? How do you feel about her relationship with Hikaru and the changes we can already see in it?


I know these are supposed to be brief recaps… but… I sort of fail at that. Whoops?

The Seventh Match – I Won’t Play Against You

In this episode, Hikaru starts at Haze Junior High. Hikaru joins the Go club and hilariously swings a dirty mop at some guys who tear down the Go club poster. Kaga comes along and taunts the tiny Go club. Even though they aren’t established as a real club yet, a teacher donates a goban and Go stones, and they set up shop in the Chemistry lab. Their first goal is to find more members so they can be an official club. Akari also joins the group. Meanwhile, Akira shows up at Haze in his Kaio uniform looking for Hikaru. Since the Go club is so small, it takes him some time before he’s able to find out where they are. He’s surprised to find out they’re in the Chemistry lab, but goes to the window to meet with Hikaru. Tsutsui and Akari discuss Hikaru’s strength, Tsutsui saying that in a bind, Hikaru brings out incredible strength, but playing normally, he still loses to him, so he’s not sure what his strength is. When Touya appears, he asks Hikaru why someone like him is in the Go club and if he’s not going to come to the Go salon anymore. He says no matter who he’s playing, he’s constantly thinking of Hikaru and how he would respond to his moves. He says that he’s become stronger so he won’t be embarrassed by Hikaru anymore as the cherry blossoms begin to fall. He says he came to say he’s waiting for Hikaru. Hikaru declares that he won’t play against Touya, to which Touya demands to know why. Hikaru says he’s going to work in the Go club with Tsutsui and enter the tournament. Touya is shocked, but Hikaru closes the window on his as he’s calling his name. Hikaru makes a silent resolution that he will make Touya wait until he catches up to him. Touya ponders why Hikaru won’t play him and decides to also enter the tournament. (Note: Though the fansubs say ‘I’ll…’ he actually says ‘boku mo’ which is closer to ‘I’ll also…’) We see the Kaio Go club, which is quite large and appears to be very strict (though it’s implied that this is because Touya is coming), and we learn that the members don’t like that Touya is entering the club. Yun decides to play Touya to determine his strength. Meanwhile, Hikaru, Tsutsui and Akari talk about recruiting new members and deliberate over whether it takes a smart person to play Go or not. Hikaru begins to teach Akari how to play, but she doesn’t even understand the basics yet and tries to move the stone to run away from atari. Yun and Akira discuss the difference between Go in Korea and Japan, noting that Go is more popular in Korea and that the children in Japan aren’t very good at Go. But Yun says he changed his mind when he transferred to Kaio, stating the children there are as strong as the children in Korea, but there are always those who are stronger, like Hikaru, but that Touya may be able to defeat him. Touya replies that that is his intention. Some girls ask Touya for a tutoring match, and though their senpai tries to get a game first, Touya tells her that she’ll have to play him some other time because the other girls asked first, angering the girl. The episode closes on Hikaru thinking ‘I’ll be waiting for you, Touya.’

The Eighth Match – The Scheme in the Rain

Hikaru buys a copy of the Meijin Tsumego book that Kaga had torn up before. Sai and Hikaru find out that Touya’s dad took the Jyudan title, giving him a total of four, and Sai realizes that Touya Kouyou is rising higher and higher. Hikaru then wonders what Touya is doing. Touya is replaying games on his own, and the others in the Kaio Go club think it’s because Touya thinks it’s a waste of his time to play the others. Yun congratulates Touya on his father’s win, but when Touya doesn’t give much of a reaction, Yun thinks to himself that Touya is an uncaring son. Touya is only thinking of Hikaru and how he joined the club just to play him; that he can’t reach the hand of God without beating Hikaru. The guy most likely to have been the third board at the tournament before Touya came challenges Touya to a game so that no one can complain if he’s replaced, and he loses, quickly resigning and leaving the room. The others are clearly upset by this, one student noting that Touya has ruined the Go club. He thinks he can best Touya, so he challenges him, taking the first move to play tengen and then mirroring Touya’s moves to reflect his strength back at him, hoping to force a tie. However, Touya knows how to get out of it and uses his strategy against him. Two other guys give the kid a hard time and they talk about Touya. Ichikawa picks Touya up while the three watch and try to come up with a way to defeat him. One of the boys says that it can’t be don’t under normal circumstances, but implies that there is a way. Tsutsui notes that Akari didn’t come and says it’s because Hikaru yelled at her, and that he should ask her to come. Hikaru says there’s no point in a girl playing Go, but Sai corrects him, saying there were many women who used to play Go even in his time. Hikaru tries to amaze Sai with his umbrella, and Sai feigns surprise for a moment before saying he’s seen it many times already. Tsutsui asks Hikaru if he said something, but Hikaru says it’s nothing and they say goodbye. Sai notes that Go hasn’t changed in a thousand years, but neither have umbrellas. Hikaru agrees, saying it can’t block all the rain and your feet get wet, and it’s inconvenient to hold it in your hand. He adds that in the age where man has gone to the moon, we’re still using umbrellas. Sai thinks Hikaru is making things up and that there is no way men can go to the moon. Hikaru assures Sai that it’s true, but Sai still thinks he’s lying, saying that even he knows it’s impossible to go to the moon. Hikaru laughs at him, telling him that really, man has gone to the moon. Sai then says if we can go to the moon, why are umbrellas still umbrellas? The three boys from the Go club are still discussing how to defeat Touya, saying that no matter what the situation is, they can humiliate Touya if they can beat him in an even match, and that they don’t have to tell anyone what the circumstances were. After brainstorming, one of them laughingly suggests they tie his arms and legs behind his back, and the others are surprised when one of them says that’s good. He then declares that they will win against Touya and shatter his pride.


Possible Discussion Questions

What do you think is the significance, if any, of the conversation about umbrellas? It seems to be more than just a passing conversation, given the amount of time spent on it, but what, exactly, is the author trying to convey to us?

When Touya approaches Hikaru at Haze Junior High, cherry blossoms begin to fall, and many of the shots feature the petals quite prominently, even including a scene where petals fall on the board. Do you think there is a symbolism behind this, and if so, what is it?

Yun thinks to himself that Touya is an uncaring son. Do you agree with this sentiment? Why or why not?

All through episode eight, we see people comparing Touya to his father. This is a reoccurring theme for Touya in Hikago. Do you think that Touya lives in his father’s shadow? Does that fact that people think of him as the Meijin’s son cheapen his own talent? As far as I can remember, what Touya thinks of this is never directly addressed. How do you think it makes him feel?

There is a lot of jealousy and anger directed at Touya in these episodes from the Kaio Go club. Do you think this is warranted? How do you feel about people scheming against Touya, and do you think that these feelings and actions are something that hurts Touya?

Please remember, use ROT13 for spoilers!

Based on the time people asked for, the chat for this discussion post will be at 6PM PST tonight! What time is that in the rest of the world? We’ll be doing episodes 7 and 8, and you’re welcome to show up early or stay late – Aja has given us permission to use it whenever we need to. Chat is here! Remember, you don't need an account, so everyone is welcome! Afterwards, I will decide on the next official chat and make an announcement about it later.

If you have any questions/comments/suggestions/etc, let me know!

Let's discuss!

Comments

Screengrbas

[onkoona]

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8-1



8-2




ep 7&8 are part of vol 2 of the manga

(frozen)

[onkoona]

(I'm starting a little early, cause the rewatch-chat is going to be a little too late for me)

Hikaru & that dirty mop:
You don't really see this in Japanse anime - they down play it as much as possible, to apeal to a more world-wide market, I guess - is that Japanese kids in Japanse schools clean the classrooms and toilets etc. themselves after class is finished. This is not a punishment for any wrong doing, this is just the way it's done. So when we see Hikaru wave that dirty mop at those Go-poster-vandals, it REALLY is the mop from the toilets, as Hikaru had been cleaning in there.

Springtime:
In Japan people are very much in awe/influenced by nature is general and the changing of the seasons in particular. Springtime is considered a new start (as it is in the west). The new school year starts then too, as we see in ep 7. Most important symbol of the spring is the cherry blossem, 'sakura'.
The very first anime I was a fan of (way before I know it was an anime) was a version of Victor Hugo's book "Sans Famille". Set in France about 1900, it was about an orphaned boy who gained a mentor who teaches him a craft (sounds familiar?) and they both travel France as a musical group trying to survive. In the anime version the change of seasons (the story took some years) was featured with as much attention as any of the main characters were. So seeing these touches of 'time passing' did/does not surprise me in anyway. (Now that you know it matters to the Japanese, you will probably notice these touches in other anime/manga more.)

Ep 7, Spring:
Is all about beginnings. Hikaru & Touya begin at a new school. Hikaru & Tsutsui & Akira make an new Go club. At the end of the ep Hikaru resolves to train with his school's Go club for the next tournament and Touya resolves to do exactly the same, even though he doesn't understand why Hikaru won't play him now.
Actually I think that what Touya does here - bow to Hikaru's conditions - is done out of deference for Hikaru's awesome talent (= Sai, Touya doesn't know that). Ab jbaqre Gbhln tbg fb vaperqvoyl znq jura Uvxneh gnxrf bire sebz Fnv va gur Whavbe Uvtu tnzr gung'f pbzvat hc

Ep 7&8, The Kaio Go club:
Oh dear. You know, if I had been a kid of that age and been at that school and had an interest in Go, I still don't think I would have joined that club. It's almost like they want to make experience bad. I think it's the intensity that a lot of Japanese things/events/interests/etc. exude. I guess it's normal for them.
Of course with the arrival of Touya, tensions are a lot worse at the club. We've heard Touya's dad tell Hikaru, how he kept his son away from youth Go tournaments and other youth Go groups. To give the others a chance, I think he said (or something along those lines). But that does mean that Touya has practically no experience at being in a group of his pears and he doesn't realize the added tension his arrival has caused. (Oh, I don't think he's utterly oblivious, but I do feel he doesn't quite get how bad it really is.)
What happens next is pretty much inevitable: jealousy. And the fact that he's a Go Grand Master's son doesn't help at all. No, Touya is a prime target for bullying; he's an outsider muscling in (he already unseated the 3rd board player of the next Junior High Tournament; one of the 3 most desirable spots to be had for any member of the Kaio Go club) and he's a loner. Talking about setting yourself up for it, geez!

Akari, the girl next door:
I do think they are meaning her to be just that. But so far she hasn't been able to do anything more, plot-wise, than stand around and look pretty. One hopes for more later. And I'm missing some background on her as well.


Hikaru & Sai & men on the moon:
One of my all time favorite S&H moments. I think the scene was just there to off set Sai's experiences against a modern world, nothing more.

(frozen)

[troisroyaumes]

Okay, let's avoid generalizations here. Yes, Hikaru no Go is rooted in Japanese culture, but let's not assume that everything about Japanese culture is strange or unusual to non-Japanese people.

You don't really see this in Japanse anime - they down play it as much as possible, to apeal to a more world-wide market, I guess - is that Japanese kids in Japanse schools clean the classrooms and toilets etc. themselves after class is finished.

First of all, it's not downplayed in a lot of series, especially shoujo series that are set in a schoolroom setting, where classroom cleaning duties is often an important plot point. Second of all, it's not something at all unique to Japan: it's common for students to clean the classroom as a regular duty in many other Asian countries and probably other parts of the world so let's not assume that a "worldwide market" is going to find the idea "unappealing".

I think it's the intensity that a lot of Japanese things/events/interests/etc. exude. I guess it's normal for them.

This "intensity" of extracurricular activities is again pretty common in places outside of Japan, including other Western countries. I had similar experience of competing to get onto the A team while doing math team in middle and high school in the U.S., and there was a lot of hostility with my peers who were trying to all get the same spot. Thankfully, there was no bullying but it does happen. You can also think about the level of competition and intensity that is brought to sports teams in schools with star players, and the environment at Kaio doesn't look at all unusual.

(frozen)

[onkoona]

No generalizations meant. All I'm saying is that somethings are different. As there will be in all the different cultures in the world; that is what makes them different, Hooray! In some countries all the activities that a child might do are are organized in and around school. In others all these things are not considered part of school life and therefore not organized at or by the school and are organized outside of school. Different. In Japan the kids clean the classes (and in other part of Asia, I'm sure). In Europe they don't. Culturally different and therefore something that becomes 'remarkable', quite literary.

The reason I mentioned the background of the mop and school cleaning in my first post, is because if you don't know about the fact that kids cleaning the school is normal, you might think that Hikaru was cleaning the bathroom as a punishment because he had been very disruptive in class (or some other misdeed). In counties where class cleaning is not normal, being sent to clean the bathroom is a heavy punishment indeed! In my school they'd expelled you sooner than make you clean the toilets! The anime/manga does not explain it, so I thought it might put things in perspective with the added information. Also because it explains something about Hikaru's character, if he got in trouble so bad in he first (few) week(s) at a new school that he had to clean the bathrooms! Now we know he isn't that bad (or that Sai's presence didn't make Hikaru disrupt the class, as happened in ep 1). Makes a huge difference, I think

As for down-playing. In the HnG anime they changed Kaga's cigarette to chewing gum, to make the anime more marketable for "western countries". Yes, I think they meant to please the USA, plain and simple. Fair enough; that's where the largest possible foreign audience is likely to be. It would work for Europe too, even though Europeans might have comments about the gum, but they will agree: smoking is far worse. (But they might not think it had needed removing, as Kaga is not a good role model in the plot anyway.)

If I'd watch a series about American math teams duke-ing it out (and I would; I love that kinda thing), I'd very probably say the same about the intensity as I've said about the Kaio Go Club. I'd watch the show with much interest and be glad I'm not part of it. The fact that it isn't about me (as HnG isn't) wouldn't stop me from enjoying the the show.

I just feel sorry for the kids at the Koio Go Club, because I'm thinking they are not having much actual fun playing the game. Go is a game after all and Maths is not, though it too can be played with and enjoyed.
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(frozen)

[troisroyaumes]

My objection isn't to your pointing out cultural differences; my objection is to your assumption that these differences are universal. You did say "worldwide appeal", not "appeal to U.S. and European countries". Please remember that members of this community come from all around the world, including many Asian countries, and even for those of us in the U.S. and Europe, many weren't originally born there. For all we know, there may also be community members who are Japanese or of Japanese descent. I'm just saying that if you're going to say "this is different in Japan" then make sure to add "this is different in Japan than from Europe" rather than assuming that it's going to be different for everyone here no matter where they're from.

I don't mind the fact that you said the Kaio Go Club was intense, but why add speculation about Japan thinking that level of intensity is normal with the added implication that no one outside of Japan would think it is? I personally think it's quite normal to be extremely invested in an extracurricular activity at that age, and I don't think there's anything wrong with it. I'm sure there are both those who will agree with me and those who will not. I'm just asking that you take the time to specify your own cultural context when you make statements about cultural differences because not all of us share that context.

(frozen)

[onkoona]

Well, all I can say I meant no harm or generalization. Next time I will be sure to put in a big disclaimer that what I say is my own opinion, from my point of view. I've never claimed anything else, but next time I'll be sure to add it in.

Also let me unequivocally state that just because I say something is not for me that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with it.

I'm detecting a culture clash here: In my culture something being different is not a value judgment. If I say something is different, it is just that. If I say that something is done/viewed as/experienced/whatever differently, than it means just that. It's doesn't mean "odd" or "strange" or "wrong". It doesn't mean "better" or "great" either. It has no judgment value at all.

Fact is that while there are many people who know loads about Japanese culture (from personal experience or whatever) there are also a lot who don't. I sure didn't. But I learned more and yes, that would be Japanese culture offset to my own. And when I heard about what Japanese pupils do in school differently from what I did in school, I was very surprised. No value judgment implied.

As for the Asian vs. Japanese issue. I'm sure a lot of Asian counties have similar if not the same way of doing things (and others that are different), but HnG is a Japanese show. It's set in Japan. It's in Japanese. When we discus the show, it's within the context of being set in Japan. If it was set in Mexico, we'd be talking Mexican culture. If it was a Korean show, that would be the context. No value judgment implied.

To avoid all misunderstandings: my opinions are my own, I don't expect anyone to agree with me.

(frozen)

[troisroyaumes]

Thanks, a disclaimer in future comments would be great and would go a long way to clarify your comments. Perhaps it's a culture clash or not, but a lot of your comments do come across as saying "odd" or "strange" rather than just "different". Moreover, as I said in my previous comment, what's "different" for you is not "different" for everyone. I think a little carefulness about making these distinctions clear would help a lot.

And yes, we are discussing a Japanese show within a Japanese context! So let's try to be careful about saying whether we're speaking from a U.S./European/[insert cultural background here] POV or not if we are going to talk about Japanese cultural differences.

(In case it isn't clear, my comment is intended to apply to everyone in this community, not just you, and yes, I'm saying that as a co-mod.)

(frozen)

[onkoona]

I thought we were having a discussion about what we think about the show. I gave my opinion in my first post. Never did I claim that it was a universal truth.

And you could have identified yourself as a community mod, thus making this entire discussion something totally different from than what I was lead to believe it was.

(frozen)

[hostilecrayon]

As a member of this - or any - community, it is your responsibility to know who the Moderators are.

(frozen)

[onkoona]

I know you are a mod. But I thought you were just joining in the discussion, since you did not ID yourself as a mod.

As a mod you should make it clear you are speaking as a mod. Because how else can anyone know if something is your private opinion or the policy of this community.

If you don't differentiate between your two roles, I will have to assume that any comment you make from now on is under you mod hat, and I will, of course, refrain from discussing anything further on the subject involved.

But I will ask you to please be clearer as to whose hat you comment under, in future, just to avoid misunderstandings.

(frozen)

[troisroyaumes]

It's not clear to me whether you meant to address this comment to hostilecrayon (whom you are replying to) or to me (whom you've been having the conversation prior to this point), but I'll assume that you intended it for me.

I began the conversation assuming that you knew I was a moderator, and I phrased my comment in a way to try to make it clear that while it was not an official "mod rebuke" but still a mod's explanation of how we would prefer culturally sensitive comments from everyone in the future. Hence the use of "let's" to apply to the whole community rather than just you as an individual. I only realized after the communication went on that you didn't seem to be aware that I was speaking as a co-mod, which is why I made it explicit in this comment. I also intended to try to reassure you that you weren't being singled out but that it was something I wanted all commenters to keep in mind for the future, but it seems that it has just put you on the further defensive.

For what it's worth, I don't hold you to blame for assuming that I was speaking as another commenter. Next time this happens, I will try to make it clear earlier on that I am speaking in a mod capacity.

That issue aside, you also said (this time in a direct comment to me): I thought we were having a discussion about what we think about the show. I gave my opinion in my first post. Never did I claim that it was a universal truth.

I'm sure it wasn't your intention to claim it as a universal; unfortunately, it isn't always clear from your comments. I'm just asking you (and yes, still asking as a mod here) that in the future to pay more attention to your words and to remember that not everyone shares your cultural context when you are talking about aspects of Japanese culture that are different from your own. Speaking about different cultures can be very controversial, not to mention potentially hurtful to other members of this community, and I (and the other co-mods) would like everyone to be careful when approaching that particular area of discussion.

(frozen)

[onkoona]

I did think you had written that comment; it's 5am here now and I've been so tired I'm seeing double for some hours now. But it still holds true: please ID yourself as a mod if you're going to do any modding, no matter who you are (well, you'd have to actually be a mod of course).

I would also appreciate if you didn't mix in a comment I made in a private mail that was not even sent to you. But since you brought it up, I'll restate my complete argument here: the original blog post here invites people to discuss. I may be naive here, but I have always thought that discussing involved voicing ones own opinions, however unpopular they unwittingly turn out to be. So I think receiving a "mod rebuke" for doing nothing other that do what was okay-ed in the original post is not called for.

In that same naivete I also assumed that posting a reply on any blog/forum anywhere was only a stating of one's own opinion, nothing more, nothing less. Do tell me if I'm wrong, but if I am, I'll not be the only one going 'round deleting loads of blog & forum entries, I'm sure!

As for cultural discussions. I do try to be considerate to peoples feeling about their cultures.
I'm in a group of 6 people (2 Japanese, 2 Brits, 2 Dutch) and we're each trying to learn each others languages (except English, we all have that). We are also taking (and one of us is giving) official lesson. Believe me, the cultural discussions we have between ourselves and the cultural information we get from our native speaking teachers is 1000 times more generalizing than I was in my first post. And understandably so, because that's how you get an insight into another culture and you learn why things are said in one way in the other language instead of in the way you are used to.

I do understand that one must be respectful of another's culture but not to such an extent that it's impossible to talk about it at all.

(frozen)

[hostilecrayon]

Everything she said was in this thread, not from the e-mail you sent to me. Please read more carefully.

(frozen)

[onkoona]

I used the words "mod rebuke" in that mail to you. troisroyaumes could only have quoted it from that mail.

But it doesn't matter, all I want is for you guys to be to try to be consistent in when you mod and when you don't. And when you ask for discussions and when you don't. 'Cause otherwise I won't know how high to jump and when.

And in return I'll try to be more careful what I write.

Yes, great idea; let's all try.

With that in mind, I'll note it's now past 6am here and I'm going to try going to sleep again.

Isn't insomnia a wonderful thing? (and isn't firefox's live spellchecker a wonderful thing too; or my replies would have been unreadable!)

(frozen)

[troisroyaumes]

When I responded to you, I hadn't known that you had sent an email to hostilecrayon (although I did hear about it afterwards), so I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that I'm "mixing in a comment made in a private mail". "Mod rebuke" is a fairly common phrase in community moderatorship and not a phrase owned by you.

But as I said explicitly in my previous comment, none of my conversation was meant as a "mod rebuke" but a "mod request" for being more careful in future comments. If it was a "rebuke", I would have frozen the thread and not permitted any replies.

You are free to make generalizations about other cultures however you like in spaces outside this community. But I have said repeatedly that we as co-mods would like people to err on the side of caution. I did not say that discussion about cultural differences is not allowed, just that when doing so, people try to (1) remember that their own cultural context is not the same as other members of the community, and (2) be very careful not to make statements that come off as describing other customs as "strange" or "not normal". This is something that my co-mods and I have discussed together and agreed on prior to my even replying to you in this post.

I am glad to hear that you will be more careful with your words in the future; that's all that you needed to say.

(frozen)

[hostilecrayon]

I will do this in parts.

First, it is never appropriate to argue a mod's decisions on the comm. Whether or not you agree, what the mods decide is law. If you wish to discuss things further, it should be done privately, not in the rewatch thread. This is unacceptable.

Second, it is definitely not your place to tell the mods how to do their jobs. Rejecting a mod's request, in public, so verbosely and aggressively as you have thus far is simply out of the question. Do not do it again. This is your only warning regarding this particular matter.

Third, the point you are arguing is something that is not, nor ever will be, up for debate. Opinions are acceptable, of course, but you have not ever shown tact in regards to this matter. You state things in a way that make it seem as if you are putting forth a fact, and you argue with those who disagree with you. I will break this down for you this one time, and after that, I never want to see these kinds of comments made on the comm again.

Culture is a diverse thing. No one group of people all share the same characteristics. When you make statements that start with "Japan does" or "The Japanese do", you are making generalizations. Generalizations are what cause racism, discrimination and intolerance. It's one thing for your Japanese friends to say "The Japanese do x" because they are Japanese. They are a part of that culture, and they are allowed to make generalized statements about themselves. You, however, are NOT Japanese. I don't care how much you have learned about it, you are not, and never will be, an authority on the matter. You cannot make generalized statements about a group you do not belong to because it is highly insulting. Even 'positive' stereotypes are unacceptable, like 'Asians are good at math'. Some Asians may indeed be good at math, but it is not necessarily the case that just because one is Asian, they must be good at math. If you have friends who enjoy making jokes and hearing jokes about this (and they are Asian), it's fine to make jokes WITH THOSE PEOPLE. This is a community that has all sorts of people from all around the globe, including Japan. When someone you don't know makes assertive statements about the culture you belong to, you become offended. This is a natural reaction because you don't actually know these things, and in addition, you're lumping all people of that group together, which is HIGHLY offensive. Your comment about natives making comments that are '1000 times more generalizing' is completely beyond the point. It doesn't matter what you think about this - we will not compromise on this point. When making statements about another culture, it is customary to say "In some parts of Japan, I've heard people x" or for people who have visited, "When I was in Japan, I noticed x was sometimes the case". When you state things as if they are facts, regardless of whether the post is your opinion or not, people think you are saying that your words are fact. You seem to not understand how to state an opinion, and your forcefulness puts people off and, frankly, is insulting. Furthermore, discussion does not equal argument, so it is imperative that when approaching sensitive issues, you make it VERY CLEAR that you are not making a factual statement.

Fourth, mods will bring up whatever they like at any time. It is not up to you what the mods do or what they discuss - if you say things to us, we have the right to call you on that. And of course, as you saw in Tari's post, you made an assumption that was not correct, and then forcefully argued the point when you were, in fact, wrong. You are NOT to use forceful language with the mods at any time, for any reason. We are the ultimate authority here, and though we are EXTREMELY lenient, there is a line, and you have not only stepped over it, but you have trampled on it with your petulant arguments despite how extremely patient and polite Tari was with you. And still, you attacked her, questioned her ability to moderate the comm that she runs, and made it very clear that despite saying you'd follow the rules, you not only don't understand what was said to you, but you actively disagree and will argue the point until you are blue in the face. Other members outside of the moderators were shocked and appalled by this behavior and your argument, and we just cannot have that on the comm. We are not willing to lose member participation to keep a member who insists on being confrontational and argumentative with the mods and other members.

With all this being said, this is an official warning. Follow the comm rules and do not repeat any of the behavior outlined here or in Tari's previous posts. If you have complaints, e-mail is the most effective and acceptable way to address them.

If you wish to continue discussing this issue, you may send a group email to hostilecrayon@gmail.com, tarigwaemir@gmail.com and queenie.eiz@gmail.com. Do not e-mail only one of us, as this is an issue that is too big to be addressed by only one of us, and please do remember in the future that I am a mod, and it is not appropriate to complain about other mods to me.

That being said, I will be freezing this thread. Do not start another one that pertains to this matter. You may post all you want about the episodes or other related things, as long as you keep this warning in mind. We have no problem with discussion, but we will not tolerate arguments and we will not tolerate behavior that upsets other members. Hopefully, we can move past this and enjoy the discussions.

[daisyface]

This is the face of heart break:









That is all.

[onkoona]

Poor Akira, he's literally left out in the cold.

[tuuli-chan.livejournal.com]

I've always rather liked Akari. Poor girl, she obviously has something of a crush on Hikaru, and just as obviously she'll remain just "the neighbor".

In fact, this reminded me of a rather good essay I once read, about homosexuality in Hikaru no go. I remember that Akari was compared to the Wisteria Maiden there... and there was also something about the significance of the cherry petals there. I should try to find that essay again...

[hostilecrayon]

You mean this essay? :D It's always in my head now, ahaha.

[tuuli-chan.livejournal.com]

Exactly, thanks! Hah, that was fast. xD

[hostilecrayon]

This icon accurately portrays everyone in Hikago in regards to AkiHika. XDDDD

Episode 7! <3333 Ugh, the cherry blossoms, the passion, the heartbreak, this has all the things I love about Hikago. Unf.

Akari

Akari. Hm. Originally, I wasn't much of a fan. And still, she's a threat to my OTP (except not really at all), but I really do feel pretty sorry for her. Her relationship with Hikaru changes so suddenly, and she is powerless to stop it. Not only do they grow apart, but nothing she does seems to affect Hikaru in the way the other new people in his life do. I think it would be very hard to understand something like that. She is forever destined to be the neighbor girl we grew up with in his eyes, and it's hard to let go of her hopes for the future. Before she is barely old enough to know what it means to love, her first love changes completely and completely slips out of her grasp. Sadness. I do think that Akari is a somewhat simplistic character - but then, we only really get to see glimpses of her, so we don't get much depth to her beyond her relationship with Hikaru. She doesn't strike me as very bright, though she's not stupid, either. She is, as expected at her age in the series, a normal girl. Unfortunately, Hikaru is anything but normal, and when Sai forces him to realize this for himself, he naturally seeks out others like himself. AKA he falls in love with Touya. Akari is left behind, and that's really sad.

Umbrella

Oh man, the umbrella/moon conversation. This is so richly laced with symbolism and subtext that it's impossible for me to put it all into words. It's obviously an important scene, as it gets quite a lot of time. I think, for one, this is a thinly veiled nudge towards the idea of 'to connect the distant past with the far future'. Things change, but no matter how much, there will always be some things that stay the same. It's interesting to think about, because it's so true. It's like the phrase 'The more things change, the more they stay the same.' Also, I think this might even be able to be construed as a kind of sometimes there are hardships that must be endured. I've pondered this a lot - the part where they talk about how you have to hold the umbrella and your feet still get wet - they spent a lot of time talking about how even though this is the case, the umbrella hasn't changed in 1000 years. Why? Because sometimes, there are hardships that just can't completely be washed away. An umbrella may help, but it can't erase it. Maybe I'm reading a little too much into this, but hey, that's what analysis is all about, right?

CHERRY BLOSSOMS

THE CHERRY BLOSSOMS. <3 I, of course, must agree with everything here. The Cherry Blossoms represent SO MUCH. Hikaru's decision to make Touya wait, starting his personal quest to reach his level, Touya's resolution to work towards playing him in the tournament, the strong emotions blossoming - so many new beginnings being portrayed here. And love. So much overwhelming love between these two characters. <3

Yun's Thoughts/Touya's Father

You know, I have a lot of thoughts about this. First of all, as gracious as Akira is, he is constantly living in his father's shadow (though he doesn't seem to hold any animosity about this). He is constantly reminded of the legacy that people expect him to live up to, and as a twelve year old boy, that can be daunting. Every congratulations is a reminder of just how much further he will be expected to go, and though Touya is extremely confident in his Go, that has to weigh heavily on him. But also, he's a twelve year old boy who has just found an obsession so great, he's acting completely out of character to pursue it. If he had never met Shindou, he'd never be anywhere near the Go Club, and he definitely wouldn't try to participate in an amateur tournament. Shindou is quite literally the only thing on his mind. I'm sure that Touya is quite proud of and looks up to his father, so I think 'uncaring' is going too far. But I also can see how he might think that - maybe he'd feel differently if he knew Touya better.

Jealousy

While I can understand the jealousy, it really is difficult to watch Touya get bullied. He is quite the oblivious child when it comes to social interactions, but I think even with that, he can feel the pressure more and more as it continues. As someone mentioned in chat, his father doesn't allow him to participate in amateur tournaments and he hangs out at the Go salon in his free time, filled with old men who ask him for tutoring games. Aside from a Go class when he was young, we don't get to see any other hobbies he might have, which makes me assume he has none. He is used to being on his own, and naturally acts as if he is alone until approached even in the Go Club. While others might think this is cold, it's really just an inability to know how else to act. Even in his Go classes, he was at the top of the class, which probably ostracized him from the others even then. And based on the few hints we get in the series, I think that Touya is extremely smart when it comes to schoolwork, as well, which implies possible further ostracism. Therefore, Touya is used to it. I wouldn't go so far as to say it doesn't affect him, though. On some level, I think Touya wishes he could fit in, just a little. It's not something he spends much time thinking about, because he has Go and that's enough for him, but to be rejected out of turn is always affecting. However, Touya unknowingly also engages in his own breed of ostracism, like when he didn't even seem to acknowledge Kaga at the tournament even though they had previously spent a good deal of time together in class, naq yngre jura ur boivbhfyl pbzcyrgryl qvfzvffrf Bpuv nf n eviny, rira gubhtu Bpuv vf fgebat, orpnhfr nyy ur pnerf nobhg vf Fuvaqbh naq fvmvat Fuvaqbh hc. Part of that may also be obliviousness, but I think he just also has no patience for people who are not as strong as him, unless that person is Shindou. XD

DFKJGHZDKLFJGHDKLFJGH I love this anime so much. <3

[onkoona]

Re: Touya.
I think he's suffering from an unavoidable tunnel vision; all he sees is Go. And the only people that really matter are those with a high potential in Go. (Not so about who he cares about, 'cause I do think he likes Ichikawa. And we haven't seen him yet with any other people outside Go yet, like his mother.)

It could be a side effect of immersing himself in high level Go at such a young age(2).

[chagrined]

I had ttly forgotten about the conversation about the umbrellas and walking on the moon, and was utterly charmed by it!

The entire scene where Touya approaches Hikaru in the chem lab is still the BEST THING EVER. YES I BELIEVE THERE IS SYMBOLISM. THE SYMBOLISM IS, THEY ARE SUPER EPICALLY GAY RIVALS 4EVER. THIS IS MY VERY IN-DEPTH ANALYSIS OF THAT SCENE. *also points at icon for reference*

I disagree with Yun-sensei's thought; Touya is obvsly really focused on pursuing Hikaru! (Well, Sai, but he thinks Hikaru, heh.) And Touya Meijin would understand and support that, and Touya also knows this. Yun-sensei thinks Touya should be focused on his dad's successes instead of pursuing his own, and neither of the Touya's would agree. Also, I think that a lot of other ppl think Touya lives in his father's shadow, but V qba'g rire frr nal fvta gung rvgure Gbhln be uvf qnq guvax bs vg gung jnl. Obgu bs gurz frrz njner bs Gbhln'f vaqvivqhny ybir bs / gnyrag sbe / qrqvpngvba gb Tb, naq Gbhln'f qnq boivbhfyl guvaxf irel uvtuyl bs uvz. Naq lrnu, gurer'f arire nal fvta V guvax gung Gbhln srryf onqyl o/p bs uvf qnq orvat fb te8.

Re: Akari... Ugh, every time I watch eps where she interacts with Hikaru (ng yrnfg gurfr rneyl barf), do I ever feel sorry for her. She obviously likes him a lot and he just treats her so thoughtlessly. V jnf unccl yngre va gur frevrf gung Uvxneh terj hc naq dhvg orunivat gung jnl (fb zhpu, naljnl). NAQ V ernyyl yvxrq gung yvxr, qrfcvgr gur snpg gung fur jnfa'g n Tb cebqvtl/rgp., Nxnev fgvyy ybirq Tb naq xrcg ba cynlvat va gur pyho, naq unq sha jvgu vg. V rawblrq gung gurer jrer gurfr qvssrerag yriryf bs orvat noyr gb rawbl Tb cerfragrq va gur fubj; abg rirelbar arrqf gb or n cebqvtl be fbzrbar jub pna orpbzr n znfgre be n ceb. Altho, while watching these eps, I also thought it'd be fun to have an AU where Akari is the one Sai appears to, rather than Hikaru. How would the whole show have changed if it had been Akari no Go?? lol for one thing I have a hard time imagining Akari would've been able to get Hikaru interested in Go like he got her interested in it...? XD

MY LAST COMMENT FOR THIS POST IS ABOUT THE COMMENT THAT ONE KAIOU CLUB MEMBER MAKES AT THE END OF EPISODE 8. Ok, since the first time I saw that episode, I SOOOOOOO WANTED/NEEDED THAT TO ACTUALLY HAPPEN. FOR THEM TO TIE TOUYA'S ARMS AND LEGS BEHIND HIS BACK AND MAKE HIM PLAY GO THAT WAY. OMG. Fb boifyl V jnf vzzrafryl qvfnccbvag jura gung qvq abg npghnyyl unccra. Naq RIRE FVAPR GURA unir ernyyl jnagrq vg gb unccra va svp. This is why we need a comm kink meme, haha, so I can post this request. (There is that crack prompts post recently, but I don't consider this a crack prompt. But I DEFINITELY NEED Touya trussed up and forced to place Go stones with his lips/tongue, mmmkay.) *____* Maybe if I try really hard and get my writing muse back I could do it, heh.

[troisroyaumes]

We are definitely planning to hold another kink meme here later in the year so be on the watch out for that. XD

[chagrined]

:D :D I WILL START KEEPING A LIST OF PROMPTS TO POST ON THAT KINK MEME!!! hahaha ♥